EVSE 120 AND 240?

2592 Views 46 Replies 10 Participants Last post by Wavshrdr, 4 mo ago

Menoche

Discussion Starter · Apr 14, 2022

Guys,
I'm having doubts.... the documentation on the EVSE says the input is only 120V, but the tag on the cable of the EVSE says input 120/240 with 12/16 amps...
I tripped all 15amps breaker in the location I am in so I am hooked with an extension on the microwave outlet which is 20Amps.

now... if the EVSE can really be plugged in a 220amps, that would mean I could hook into the exterior 220outlet for EV chargers. but is it? which to I believe? the book or the Label on the EVSE cable?

Phil

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Oldun

· #2 · Apr 14, 2022 (Edited)

I regret I don't have an answer for you, and I'm puzzled too.

I have charged a LW with both OEM and HD approved-modified car cables, with 220-240V household current, also via an e-bicycle free charging socket, and also a Level 2 charger which the LW obviously scaled down to level I; all without any difficulties (so far). It does not seem to me likely that HD would supply different EVSEs and cables to different parts of the world.

Also, maybe I'm drawing a long bow here, but looking at the LWs that rode the length of South America, they would have been charging in some very dodgy situations.

***

A couple of weeks ago I sent a polite request to HD headquarters asking for clarification on charging via a inverter-equipped 15 amp-rated generator as a backup to electricity in my shed.

Would be nice as others have said here, if a Harley representative would take an interest in this forum as we are pretty much all great supporters of the LiveWire and the HD e-brand.

Reactions: 1

Menoche

Discussion Starter · #3 · Apr 16, 2022

Allright, if for some of you it can help, here is the item I bought which saved me.
in the parking lots, the owners have Oven 220volts connectors for level 2 EV chargers.
I bought this: 4-Prong 220-Volt Plug to 120-Volt 15/20Amp Female Adapter Power Cord for Household (4-Prong 14-50 Outlet to (4) Household W/Breaker) : Amazon.ca: Tools & Home Improvement

a 220V 4 prong adapter to 4 120V outlets.
Since the 220V is a double 40 amps breaker, each side of the 120V adaptor has it’s own built in 20amp breaker in which I connect my EVSE. Problem solved for me!!!
My only remaining problem is the EVSE which does NOT lock with the included insert… has anybody succeeded in locking the EVSE?

NoPipeCommute

· #4 · Apr 17, 2022

Sounds like your OBC or AC filter gone. Same case for my wouldn't charge using any AC points only DC.

NoPipeCommute

· #5 · Apr 17, 2022

Oldun said:
I regret I don't have an answer for you, and I'm puzzled too.

I have charged a LW with both OEM and HD approved-modified car cables, with 220-240V household current, also via an e-bicycle free charging socket, and also a Level 2 charger which the LW obviously scaled down to level I; all without any difficulties (so far). It does not seem to me likely that HD would supply different EVSEs and cables to different parts of the world.

Also, maybe I'm drawing a long bow here, but looking at the LWs that rode the length of South America, they would have been charging in some very dodgy situations.

***

A couple of weeks ago I sent a polite request to HD headquarters asking for clarification on charging via a inverter-equipped 15 amp-rated generator as a backup to electricity in my shed.

Would be nice as others have said here, if a Harley representative would take an interest in this forum as we are pretty much all great supporters of the LiveWire and the HD e-brand.

Whats the HD HQ email? I try to email the customer care and got a reply of my case not capture. The dealer that I bought the bike from is not helping.

Menoche

Discussion Starter · #6 · Apr 17, 2022

My problème really was cheap breakers that pop too easily, the EVSE charges the bike just fine but trips the external breakers which are 15 amps on the weak sides as they trop way too soon. .

NoPipeCommute

· #7 · Apr 17, 2022

I see. So if you charging it at a public charger it ok?

Menoche

Discussion Starter · #8 · Apr 17, 2022

Indeed, the only place it does not work is on both external 120V outlet at my girlfriend’s place

i hooked an extension to the microwave 20 Amps circuit and it had worked

Oldun

· #9 · Apr 17, 2022

NoPipeCommute said:
Whats the HD HQ email? I try to email the customer care and got a reply of my case not capture. The dealer that I bought the bike from is not helping.

[email protected]

also

"Harley-Davidson Corporate Headquarters Address: 3700 W. Juneau Avenue, Milwaukee, WI 53208. You may send your queries or complaints and also your suggestions or feedback at this address. You can get in touch with corporate office on this phone number 1-414-342-4680"

(UPDATED OCTOBER 27, 2020)

Reactions: 1

NoPipeCommute

· #10 · Apr 19, 2022

Oldun said:
[email protected]

also

"Harley-Davidson Corporate Headquarters Address: 3700 W. Juneau Avenue, Milwaukee, WI 53208. You may send your queries or complaints and also your suggestions or feedback at this address. You can get in touch with corporate office on this phone number 1-414-342-4680"

(UPDATED OCTOBER 27, 2020)

Thank you Oldun!

Nwfg

· #11 · Apr 20, 2022

Forgive me if I’m “beating a dead horse”, you and the others, my have this stuff already figured out.
And I am by no means an electrical expert nor a LiveWire expert, in order words you should verify this information, and please correct me if this info is wrong.
As far as I know, normally the J-1772 connector puts out 240V AC, which the Livewire has to be able to accept or you would not be able to charge on a Level-1 (AC) Commercial / Public Charger. Again as far as I know, the OBC (On Board Charger) will only use 120V, so it doesn’t matter 120V AC or 240V AC, the OBC will only charge at the 120V AC Level -1 rate.
I know this has been covered before, but if the circuit you plug into has a breaker that will handle the Amps required, but there are other loads on the same circuit breaker which when combined with the Livewire’s OBC exceeds the breakers amperage, then obviously the breaker will throw.
Below is a photo of a 2020 Livewire OBC, the label states: Input 90-275Vac ~ 16.5A Max. So if the circuit can’t handle that you could have problems.

B

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Reactions: 1

NoPipeCommute

· #12 · Apr 20, 2022

Nwfg said:
Forgive me if I’m “beating a dead horse”, you and the others, my have this stuff already figured out.
And I am by no means an electrical expert nor a LiveWire expert, in order words you should verify this information, and please correct me if this info is wrong.
As far as I know, normally the J-1772 connector puts out 240V AC, which the Livewire has to be able to accept or you would not be able to charge on a Level-1 (AC) Commercial / Public Charger. Again as far as I know, the OBC (On Board Charger) will only use 120V, so it doesn’t matter 120V AC or 240V AC, the OBC will only charge at the 120V AC Level -1 rate.
I know this has been covered before, but if the circuit you plug into has a breaker that will handle the Amps required, but there are other loads on the same circuit breaker which when combined with the Livewire’s OBC exceeds the breakers amperage, then obviously the breaker will throw.
Below is a photo of a 2020 Livewire OBC, the label states: Input 90-275Vac ~ 16.5A Max. So if the circuit can’t handle that you could have problems.

B View attachment 921

OBC normally will automatically accept any voltage and amp. It will still convert it into DC of 200-300v depending on the BMC (Battery Management Controller) and stay at max claim of 1.3kw. In other word it's only pulling 10amp on a 120v line max or 5amp on a 240v line. Hardly it will trip anything even if it sharing the same MCB with others.

Nwfg

· #13 · Apr 20, 2022

Thank you NoPipeCommuter for making it simple. I believe “You are correct sir”,
120V x 10A = 1200W and 240v x 5A = 1200W. As the OBC label states: Output: 1260W Continuous.
So either 120V or 240V the OBC will only charge at 1200W.
If the circuit you are charging on has 120V at the outlet, a good 15A breaker with everything wired correctly and the combined load on the circuit does not exceed 15A, you should be good, if not then you need to check the breaker, wire and wire connections, outlet and outlet contacts.
Again please correct any errors.

Wavshrdr

· #14 · 9 mo ago

Hate to resurrect a thread but it seems like the most relevant one.

From what I see here (and read elsewhere), regardless of if it is L1 (110V) or L2 (220V), the charge rate will be the same of ~11 hours to charge from 0 - 100%. When researching the bike, I read somewhere and can't find it now, that someone was able to charge from 0-100% around 9.5 hours.

This seems impossible given the rated output of the OBC. Can anyone using 220V confirm how long it takes to charge from 0-100%? I ask because I have seen things sometimes work differently than what they claim they do or how they are labeled. IF there was actually some gain to use 220V in the reduction of charging times, it would be a definite benefit for me.

Reactions: 1

Menoche

Discussion Starter · #15 · 9 mo ago

I did 9.5 once, but the temperature in the garage was about 10C. L1 or L2 does not, change much as the onboard computer regulated the current in function of the battery temperature to preserve it. Today, with 35C in the garage, it’ll mostly take 11 hours unless i turn the big fan in front Of the radiator.

Reactions: 2

Wavshrdr

· #16 · 9 mo ago

Thanks, that is helpful. I have a 220V 50A circuit I could use for this. I have a big fan as well. I am just trying to understand if it is worth the effort and to increase charge speed 10-15% it might be. Lately my garage has been at about 30C.

Might be worth hooking it up to the 220V circuit and see. I know it won't draw 50 amps but generally using 220 is more efficient anyway. Pennies to charge the bike though.

Reactions: 1

Menoche

Discussion Starter · #17 · 9 mo ago

220 won’t give you faster charge.
what could tho, is an EVSE which supports a bit higher than 15 amps. I got one from amazon which allows either 10 or 16 amps. Even at 16 amps, the OBC adjusts power delivery in function of the charge level and temperature.
last night for example, it took 5 hours to bring it back from 83% because the temperature was so high And i neglected to turn the fan on.
This is mainly the reason Harley tells us it’s not worth to use level 2 as it would not charge faster.
the only way is pretty much to get a Low Power CC charger but the cost is pretty steep for the gain.

Adventures on Zero

· #18 · 9 mo ago

Menoche said:
220 won’t give you faster charge.
what could tho, is an EVSE which supports a bit higher than 15 amps. I got one from amazon which allows either 10 or 16 amps. Even at 16 amps, the OBC adjusts power delivery in function of the charge level and temperature.
last night for example, it took 5 hours to bring it back from 83% because the temperature was so high And i neglected to turn the fan on.
This is mainly the reason Harley tells us it’s not worth to use level 2 as it would not charge faster.
the only way is pretty much to get a Low Power CC charger but the cost is pretty steep for the gain.

The only benefit with using a level 2 would be more consistent voltage, but I'm not sure how much time that would shave off - maybe 45mins 🤷‍♂️

Wavshrdr

· #19 · 9 mo ago

It might be worth buying one of the portable 7 or 10kW CCS chargers. Looks like I can pick one up for a few grand. Doing a bit of research to find a good option. If I can do it for under 3k, I am in. It would also work with Energica as well and a few others.

Phaedrus

· #20 · 9 mo ago

Wavshrdr said:
It might be worth buying one of the portable 7 or 10kW CCS chargers. Looks like I can pick one up for a few grand. Doing a bit of research to find a good option. If I can do it for under 3k, I am in. It would also work with Energica as well and a few others.

If you've got the 3-phase power to support it, you are luckier than most of us.

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